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Brett Hornig returns to the podcast to go provide an in-depth preview of the 2023 Western States 100. We analyze the course, talk about what it's going to take to be successful, note some of the interesting storylines around the event, and yes, make our predictions for the female and male top 10 finishers this year.
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Welcome back, or welcome to the Single Track podcast. I'm your host, finn Milansen, and in this episode I'm joined by my colleague, red Horning to preview the 2023 Western States 100 Men's Field. Before we get started, though, this episode is brought to you by Hoka Rabbit Morton and Features Head to the show notes page of this episode for new product releases and discount codes from each of our four sponsors. With that, let's get started.
Speaker 2:We are live.
Speaker 1:This is the 2023 Western States 100 Men's Field preview. We will be doing the Women's Field preview tomorrow night, Wednesday evening, same time. Brett, I am unironically wearing a puffy jacket right now because it is freezing here in Olympic Valley.
Speaker 2:Yes, and even though we're not paying for the utilities, we still don't have the heat on. Today was cold, you know, it was maybe 50 degrees up here, and even on our run this morning I actually remember going over a little piece of dirt that had some water on it and it was frozen.
Speaker 1:Indicative of what we can expect Saturday. Right, Should we talk about the weather first. Maybe we can talk about the weather in a way that it'll roll into tomorrow's episode too.
Speaker 2:Oh, the weather outside is weather.
Speaker 1:How many modellos did you have?
Speaker 2:One Uno.
Speaker 1:My gosh. Well, just to set the table for the episode, we're going to talk about said weather. We'll get into course conditions a bit, i think, before we go deep into the athletes at this race. We'll talk historically about how this race has been won, how it's been podiumed, how it's been top 10. Then we'll get into the athletes and we'll talk about sort of categories of international runners, returners, people that got in this year via Golden Ticket, and then I think from there we can offer our Yeah, that sounds like a great itinerary.
Speaker 2:I was getting a little distracted watching your feed, seeing it's actually looking a little bit choppy, i'm wondering if that's us.
Speaker 1:I think it's just the internet.
Speaker 2:I think we might have too many people on the Wi-Fi. I think everyone might have turned the Wi-Fi off on the phones. The incubator here is overloading the internet.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we got to reduce our bandwidth. I think the next time we do this in 2024, already looking ahead to 2024, we're going to prioritize the best possible internet connection.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but that was also just like a PSA to all the people sitting behind us to Turn off the internet.
Speaker 1:Get off the internet.
Speaker 2:But you should actually pull yours, you should pull it back up so that way we can monitor the feed and make sure it's okay. Yeah, so definitely, the big thing that everyone loves to talk about leading up to Western States is the weather especially. I mean that goes all the way back through the winter of like will it be a snow year, will it not? What's the high country going to look like? And then we learned that it's going to be pretty hot or was going to be pretty snowy, and everyone thought it was going to be really hot, because that's usually the case at Western States, but it's turning to be a relatively cool year, which I don't know. I feel like that turns the tables a little bit And I don't think it necessarily makes the course any easier or the race any easier. It just like changes the skill set that you need to have a little bit. It becomes much less of like a war of attrition and more so I mean very much more so like a foot race.
Speaker 1:And are there any runners? like a month ago, when we had the information we had, you were thinking like, yeah, in a snow year, combine that with the heat. they're set up for a good win or a good performance here, versus the people that you may think are set up to do well here on Saturday because it's now cool with snow in the high country. Like, based on the like the word combinatorics again, because we've used that on the single track podcast What are you expecting here on Saturday? What's changed for you?
Speaker 2:Well. So what I always thought was interesting even though it doesn't really necessarily go in hand in hand is I always thought those that would survive a snow year high country would also be the ones who would do well in the heat. Because it's like kind of, if you're good at difficult conditions, you're usually good at difficult conditions. You know, if you're good at running, you're good at running, but we're not getting difficult of both of those scenarios. We're getting difficult conditions up in the high country, but then we're going to get very fast conditions past, you know, robinson flat or around the 30 mile mark. So then you kind of have like the does the amount of energy or the amount that the first 50 K is going to slow you down outweigh how much faster the last you know the next 70 miles are going to be? That's kind of always goes to the debate of like whether this the times will actually be faster than average or not. Yeah, can you know someone who will excel up in the high country and maybe cover the first 50 K more efficiently than someone else? will they then have the legs to be able to just race the next 70 miles really hard? Yeah, so it changes the skill set a little bit And I think that, just because of how much cooler it's going to be, this course is going to play into the hands of those who are pretty fast and, like, good at running. I think we're going to see fast times and I think they're not going to come until after Robinson flat. So, like the times through, you know, 30 miles are not going to be that impressive, but then I bet, from 30 to the finish we start seeing, you know, like top three, top five, all time splits across most of the sections of the course.
Speaker 1:It's fascinating to me. We had Tom Evans on the show three or four days ago just discussing his thoughts on how the race would play out in these current conditions. We had the information around a relatively cool day with still some stone in the high country available to us. He thought that in spite of those conditions in the high country for that first third of the race Robinson flat you would see a 15 hour pace roughly from Robinson flat to forest till you'd see about 1430 pace. And then he anticipates from forest till to the finish, strava segments going down, crowns being reassigned, sub 14 to the finish And that would average up to somewhere around 1430 winning time. Do you do you think he was kind of ballparking it correctly?
Speaker 2:I actually really do. I think 1430 is a winning time is not out of the question. I don't think it's a guarantee because that that's going to involve taking some risk, maybe not in the first 30 miles, but from Robinson flat to last chance, that's like 30 to 42. That's a dozen miles. That's very runnable. It's a little bit downhill. Someone needs to risk it a little bit and probably average, probably under seven minute pace for that section And regardless of temperature, that's a little bit of a risk to all of a sudden rip a whole bunch of 630 to seven minute miles from miles 30 to 42 of a race. I think we just published the Jeff Cole.
Speaker 1:It's on YouTube. Yes, it's on YouTube. Okay, jeff's prepared to go sub 15 if he has to.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, jeff is podium or bust. I loved that interview. Everyone should go check it out after this, but the guys dialed. one thing that he said that I always thought was a joke. that I think is actually a real thing is running every step of the race, or at least running every step of the canyons. Working at Rogue Valley runners, i've gotten to hear a lot of great Western state stories and how it would always be like what are? these people doing? when hiking up the canyon I was like would anyone seriously run up Devil's Thumb? And he was like, of course, of course you run every single step. You don't want to, you don't want to let the mind slip. He's like, even if it's the same pace, you want to keep the feet moving, keep running, because you got to keep the engine burning hot, like you don't want to lose any of those gears. And I was like, are you nuts? But then you know, like seeing like Jim the last few years he would. he ran every step of the course and like more and more people are running. Yeah larger percentage. of course, and I think this is kind of only referring to if you're trying to hop on the podium. I think you can still absolutely hike your way to a top 10. But I don't think you can hike your way to the podium anymore.
Speaker 1:See, that's what I'm. I interesting point there. I'm wondering when we'll see the day where it's no longer possible to even hike your way into the top 10. And it reminds me of you know that age quote. Like 30 is the new 20. And maybe this is a data request or just a fun thing for aid station fireball Liam, to research over the course of the history of the Western States, finishing times. When did you know and I know it's weather dependent, condition, dependent to but like when did we start to see like sub 17 hours become the new sub 18 hours? and like, for example, this year are we going to finally have a year where there's more than just three guys going sub 15? Like, could we see the entire top five in the men's field go sub 15? So, given the caliber runners in the field, the pedigree, you know how many people go sub 15? Is it mandatory in the top 10 to go sub 15 30? Like what are we talking about? Like what's at stake?
Speaker 2:Yeah, i mean one thing that we've it seems like we've been seeing less of in ultras is major blowups and more into like minor fades. With that being said, this is still Western States And for some reason we do still see a good amount of explosions. You know people and like I remember, last year I came through the Auburn Lake trails aid station and I was pretty blown up But I was still moving well, and I get to the aid station And I see like every single cot is full, like it was like triage center, and I sat down, i'm eating some potatoes and I look over and I just think I, who is Natalie Cherwin, was pacing me and I look over and I go Oh man, i'm glad I'm not that person And the sheet moves and head pops up and it was Rod Barbara and he goes.
Speaker 1:Hey Brett.
Speaker 2:And I was like, oh no, hey, rod. And then the next caught over the sheet moves and someone who looked like damn near dead just like pokes over their head of me. It was Jared Hazen. And I was like, oh no, like. So like the explosions last year at Western States were still very much like alive and well, which is kind of backwards saying that.
Speaker 1:But veteran and analytical runners been. Rod is very analytical.
Speaker 2:Jared's a veteran, Yeah it can really happen to anyone And so much of it depends on just like, yeah, like like a station fireball, So like how many biscuits are you willing to risk on Saturday? And that's, Jeff said two or three. He thinks he can override at least two or three. He did actually say yeah, he's like I think I can override two or three of those things, telling me to stop and go like a little bit harder. Also part of the race day magic. You know people, competition oftentimes brings amazing performances out of other people. Well, I think with Western States being, you know, sure, maybe it's not the most competitive ultra in the world, But just with how, the qualifying process, the oldest hundred, you know all the hype and like the mean, the small field, it adds a lot of extra pressure which you really learn at this race, like who is clutch, Because coming back next year is guaranteed for no one.
Speaker 1:A couple questions I have for you, and I think this probably relates to course conditions, and this is just based off of what Craig Thornley has posted on Twitter about kiss the lucky egg man. Yeah, man, just based on the photos we've seen from Robertson flat from Greg Thornley and just anecdotally what we know about that section, how much attrition do we see in the high country and then also probably new for this year along Cal Street where that burn scar is? What role does that play in either? I mean slowing things down potentially right, just with how much heat there is there, how much exposure there is there, like we are talking about? I mean, tom Evans is talking about a record breaking sprint from forest till to the finish, but is that a blocker for this?
Speaker 2:You know. I think I mean fortunately, we're only looking at about 80 degrees in Auburn. It'll be a handful of degrees warmer down in the river. The canyons will still feel warm But they're not going to feel hot. Does that mean you really approach the way like your cooling strategies any differently? I don't think so. I think you should still treat it as if it's 100, like load up on the ice. Be getting yourself as well. I think there's going to be a lot of people out there who are going to be like Oh, i've been training for 100, it's only 80. And they kind of write it off. There is so much more exposure out on the course. Yeah, i got to run the whole middle section of the course during the Memorial Day. Turn camera is doing a little single track scouting mission for today's episode And you know the top of you know the climb going up to Devil's thumb. It's torched, there's very little shade there And like the time of the day when the men's leaders will come through, it will have like that Canyon will have had some time to heat up. The Sun will be hitting them, especially the very last quarter of the climb. It was only in the 70s when I did it and I was dripping sweat. It felt really hot. Michigan bluff the climb up to Michigan bluff at El Dorado It's even worse, like it's been fully torched. The the shade that used to get from the manzanitas. It's all gone, it's fully exposed. I didn't run from Michigan bluff to Forest Hill, i stopped in Michigan bluff so I was tired.
Speaker 1:So you're saying there's a chance we might still see the classic Ryan Sands, courtney DeWalter, solomon, ice bucket hats.
Speaker 2:I think so, like I think there's, there should still be a good amount of ice used on race day. The difference there, though, with what the ice does is, instead of the ice keeping you from just like rolling up into the fetal position And crying on the side of the trail, it will be the difference between you running fast or running slow.
Speaker 1:I Think, before we get into the the men's field a little bit deeper, i'd love to talk historically about how this race has been won a how it's been podiumed to be and See how it's been top 10, because we do have some interesting data here. Shout out to eight station fireball for providing the goods. I think this is interesting because part of what it tells me is The race doesn't necessarily start at Forest Hill. I think you have to be in it way earlier. Is that something you agree with?
Speaker 2:It is something I agree with, now that I can see the numbers and, like you, see it on paper And it's like if you want to podium or win this race, you have to be willing to roll the dice a little bit early on. That doesn't mean, you know, go off the front and be well under course record pace. It just means you need to be in the Top 10 Towards, towards the front. You need to be paying attention to the front of the pack.
Speaker 1:Here's a stat and this is a Robinson flat stat since 1998. So the last 25 years of this race, there have only been three years. We're talking 20, 6, 20, 9 in 2016 where a top 3 men's finish has come from a runner outside the top 10 at Robinson flat. So the major takeaway here is you want to be in the top 10 through Robinson flat if you want to have a shot at a top 3 finish 2016. You remember that was a legendary Jeff Browning. I think he got third place. He got the podium there. Granted, he did benefit heavily from Wamsley taking that wrong turn at mile 93, which really only puts 20 0, 6 and 20 9 into consideration here. It's very difficult so To be in contention for a podium spot.
Speaker 2:You need to be right there, robinson flat, that's 30 miles into the race yeah, and Some people are going to have a hard time staying in contention to Robinson flat this year Because there's a lot of snow up there. You need to be comfortable running in the snow and you can't. Your balance needs to be good. You know you can't take that many falls. You can't take that many. You know those foot slips where you have to like flex. You know You're groin and your hip flexor and everything in your leg to stay upright. You only get so many of those in a run. You don't want to burn all those matches in the first 50k because then When do you get to start racing?
Speaker 1:This is a Michigan bluff stat since 2003, so the last 20 years of the race there's only been one year again 2016 that Jeff Browning year were a top three finisher. A podium finisher has come from a runner outside the top 10 at Michigan Bluff and ideally if you want to be in a podium spot, the data tells us you want to be in that top five or six runners through Michigan Bluff. So barely half way through the race you have to be in contention. I think For some people there has been this narrative where you know You can hang around in the back half of the top 20, maybe even the front half of the top 30, and still be fighting for contention, but no, like you really have to be up there racing hard early in the race. This is fascinating stuff.
Speaker 2:We got AJW in the chat.
Speaker 1:It was awesome. I love it. Aj loved, loved the preview episode earlier and.
Speaker 2:I love. I love how you got called out.
Speaker 1:Oh.
Speaker 2:I was listening to it live and I was busted out laughing. The only person who bets against Courtney DeWolf or it's been Melanson, yeah, that was. That was so good.
Speaker 1:We love it. We love it.
Speaker 2:That's archived on that's archived on air Vipe is YouTube channel, so if you need another, another preview episode or perhaps I'm sure everyone actually has already watched that one is now watching this one. But Yeah, super interesting that you know. If you want to be in, if you want to fight for the podium, you need to be right around the top five by Michigan Bluff. And, like we're not making this up, this is just according to numbers people.
Speaker 1:Here's here's some top ten stats. This is really interesting. Since 1998 again the last 25 years of the race There's only been seven years 98, 0102, 0306, 10 and 16 where a top 10 men's finish has come from outside the top 25 at Robinson flat. The last person to do this was Kyle Piatari in 2016. So really it had been. It's tough. You have again, you have to be in contention even early on for a top 10 spot. I found that very interesting, like I just think there's a little bit of a narrative shift here about where the race starts.
Speaker 2:So if you were to put a mileage on where the race starts, what would you say?
Speaker 1:I think the race starts at Robinson flat. I want to. I want to change the talking point from forced till to Robinson flat.
Speaker 2:And like I guess I don't know. I can always go back and forth, because I'm like what does that even mean when the race starts? Because it's not like you're all of a sudden hammering at Robinson flat like you're, like you're maybe trying a little bit harder, but like you should still very much be in control. But you're like you're like You can't go to sleep, like your mind has to be race racing in, not like the bad way.
Speaker 1:I would love to retire the phrase. The race starts at X in off the front. If we can minimize the use of those two drinks.
Speaker 2:Drink every time they say off the front on the on the live stream on Saturday.
Speaker 1:Just a couple more stats here. We promise that we love. We love this data stuff again. Shadow aid station fireball. But a little bit more data here for you. This is around Which aid stations does the eventual race winner take and keep the winning lead?
Speaker 2:So oh yeah, this was a good one.
Speaker 1:Historically in the history of Western states, there's been five Tape to tape wins on the men's side. There's been 21 Tape to tape wins on the women's side. Of course you chalk those women's victories up to Anne Trace and Nikki Kimball. There's been four races one by men in the high country, three for the women, 11 at some point between last chance and four still on the men's side This is where Scott Jerich often took the lead in many of his wins and four on the women's side Ten on Cal Street for the men, four for the women. This is how Adam Peterman did it last year. This is how Kat Bradley did it in 2017, and then six between Auburn Lakes and the track. This is, of course, how Jeff Rose did it in that unbreakable year and won for the women the year after. Ellie Greenwood did it. Anything interesting there for you.
Speaker 2:It was surprising to see how like Like it's it's actually somewhat spread out, like it's, not like Overwhelmingly. Everyone wins the race, you know, at Michigan Bluff or something like that like it's. But It's cool to see like someone like Scott Jerich very much had a race plan every single year and stuck to it, you know, having taken the lead through the canyons most of the times. I Also thought it was fascinating that how Kerner Has a wire-to-wire.
Speaker 1:Yes, I don't know if you said that one out loud. I think a wire-to-wire that 2009.
Speaker 2:How was like in? first officially at the very first aid station and then won the race?
Speaker 1:Like AJW, is loving that we're talking mid 2000s Western.
Speaker 2:States right now. I know we're we tried, we tried, so we're trying so hard to like.
Speaker 1:Not just talking about the last 2008.
Speaker 2:Western States. Tell me more. I mean, i wish I could have witnessed some of those years like because well, there's the other one the split of From the start to Red Star aid station Yep, I think it's Hal and Scott, how, how Kerner, scott, jerich, and I Forget who else it was there was three that went through in what is still the fastest split ever, and You know the fact that, like Jim hasn't even hit those splits and yet Jim, you know, ran like two hours faster. You'd think how could any of those three possibly have gone on to finish the race that year? And the crazy thing was, like how went on to win that year? like Talk about just like being really tough, of just going out like crazy hard and then just also winning?
Speaker 1:A station fireball says Katie Shied Race starts at the start line.
Speaker 2:I like that and I think You know there's there. What there's probably is multiple like mindset shifts over the course of the race. But You better be in the right mindset at the start and you know that's part of the race. So you got to be paying attention like you kept. You can't be totally checked out, especially with yeah, and you also can't accidentally go like way too hard up the escarpment. Yeah yeah, I mean you've witnessed a Western state start and how exciting it is and all the energy and how it's just like a Horde of people going up a dirt road. It's kind of chaotic and it's usually oftentimes way too fast.
Speaker 1:Just building more off of what Liam said there in the chat. I know that only a fool aka myself. Whatever bet against Courtney in any of these races and I think If I was a betting man I would say on Saturday Courtney leads from wire to wire and Runs 1620, gets the course record like I think. That's it, that's. That's not an unreasonable bet to make.
Speaker 2:I love how this is the men's preview and we're just gonna talk about how Courtney's gonna run this race.
Speaker 1:I'll just say last thing I'm so excited that Katie shides in this race, so excited that Emily hog is in this race, because I think in. Heather Jackson, because I think they're gonna be right up there Challenging her the whole way, which is just fun as a fan for the sport. So didn't you like, ruin tomorrow's episode.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, okay, i'll let me tie it back. So We've kind of said like this is Courtney's race to lose. I Don't believe that exists on the men's side.
Speaker 1:There is not a single name where it's their race to lose.
Speaker 2:It's a whole bunch of different guys. It's their opportunity to win, but I wouldn't say there's one person where it's like it's their race to lose.
Speaker 1:The only person I might entertain that for is Hayden Hawks. Hayden Hawks ran eighth or ninth place here two years ago, second here last year.
Speaker 2:I think the Tom Evans got third and he's run faster I.
Speaker 1:Think there's just something uniquely American about this race where it's like you defend your home turf and I feel like we have been Waiting for. There's two people that I've been waiting to win Western States Hayden Hawks and Tim Tollefson and this is Hayden's third swing at it. I think it hasn't gotten as much attention in the same way Jim's did, because Jim had these, you know, epic attempts, epic blow-ups, before he eventually, you know, found glory. But I think there is a storyline there for Hayden where it's like third time, and you're an elite runner, sure is on.
Speaker 2:I mean Hayden got second last year. He is the highest Returner, you know, because Adam Peterman is not racing this year due to injury. Hayden Hawks is the highest finisher coming back and you know I wrote down a little bit about, about, about Hayden. Like Hayden has put in some monster training for this race. I mean him, him and Daniel Jones From New Zealand have actually done a lot of training together and some of their weeks have just been Insane. There was one week that I was looking at on Strava were Hayden and Dan Jones. They just spent a whole week in the Grand Canyon and I think they went down into the canyon to the to the bottom, usually a little bit past Phantom Ranch and up towards Lake the North Rim Five times in a week. Like I think the week ended up being 120 or 130 miles and you know 30 plus thousand feet of climbing and that wasn't like a one-off week. Hayden's had multiple 130 mile weeks. I remember early, early on this year I don't remember if it was with his nutrition sponsor, precision hydration, but yeah, it was with someone. He ran on a treadmill the entire first 50k profile of the course with a mask on that simulated the Altitude, and they were measuring all of his numbers regarding, like, what was his oxygen consumption? What was his efficiency? Yeah, what was his metabolic rate? Yeah, he's been got a whole bunch of inside tracker tests on to see, like, exactly where he's deficient.
Speaker 1:Yep.
Speaker 2:He's gotten the sweat tests. This year, hayden did a lot of things outside of training to dial in The elements that oftentimes derail people's races.
Speaker 1:We did a long run archives episode maybe three or four months ago And I asked Brett the question if you could list out, if you could bullet point list out, everything you would do like throwing in the kitchen sink If you had all the free time in the world to be an elite athlete in this sport. I'm pretty sure Hayden ticked off every single one of those boxes you listed on that episode.
Speaker 2:Yeah, even no stone unturned. And he did all that in six days a week.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Hayden.
Speaker 2:Hayden runs six days a week, so he was getting in 130 miles of training off of six days. So, you know, we always talk about, you know, tom Evans being, you know, checking all the boxes of professional intellectual, but Hayden's right there. Hayden's doing it too. And Yeah, i mean, and Hayden Hayden's got you know an an amazing, you know pedigree of running prior to Switching over to the trails. I mean he was a stat over at Southern Utah University. I mean, Yeah, very fast, you know who is. You know, one of his teammates was Cam Levin's.
Speaker 1:Cam Levin's king of the triple.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean. So If the if. If anyone's been a witness to hard work, it's Hayden Hawks.
Speaker 1:And I know I've said this on the podcast and on YouTube live multiple times If there's one podcast to listen to, one podcast episode to listen to before Western States on Friday, go check out Hayden Hawks interview with Billy Yang pre Western States last year. You know Hayden speaking from the hip. It's super inspiring. You want to run through a brick wall after listening to it. So maybe we can link to it when this goes to audio on the podcast. But excellent, excellent episode to Understand just how much hard work and dedication and enjoy he puts into this race and I that's. That's the reason why I say I think there might be some pressure there, because he's put so much heart and soul into this. He's made progression and I have always associated him with being like One of the potential successors to Jim Wamsley's dominance at this race.
Speaker 2:Okay, here's an interesting question. So does it worry you at all that Hayden and and Dan Jones and Jones? Does it worry you that Hayden and Dan Jones have been doing nearly all their training together? What's?
Speaker 1:your theory.
Speaker 2:Well, last time they raced at Tarware, dan beat Hayden. How does like and then, and then you're training the same. How, like? how would that get in your head to being like shoot, i'm not doing anything more than this guy. You beat me at the last race.
Speaker 1:Does that does?
Speaker 2:that mess with your mind at all.
Speaker 1:I don't know. Yeah, I'll be really curious to know how linked up they are like. In the same way, you know, we saw Ruth Croft and Emily Hogg had sharing whatever there was the first 50 miles of of Western states last year. Well, we see a similar tandem type work with Dan and Hayden. Just to organize this next part of the the conversation, brett, i want to. I'd love to talk about categories of runners. So we've we've broken it down into internationals.
Speaker 2:International gold-ticket winners.
Speaker 1:National golden-ticket winners, returners to this race, and then, i think, miscellaneous Sponsors yep. Where we dive it in.
Speaker 2:I think we should. Let's do some of the returners, since we kind of started with Hayden I mean, you know he's gonna be rocking the MT bib There's a lot of returners coming back. This is something that's somewhat unique to the men's field. Of women's fields a little bit different, we'll talk about tomorrow. So I'm just like really quick, we got like M2, m3, m4, m6, m8, m9, m10. So M3 being Arlen Glick. Arlen Has, well, one, arlen Arlen. I know AJW is the number one, arlen Darlin in the chat and possibly the world.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I respect that.
Speaker 2:Yep, i do too. I Yeah, i mean, i got, yeah, i got to talk to Arlen. You know, bed at the training camp runs He. So I guess, if we were to even subcategorize some of these runners, i put Arlen in the 100 mile specialist 100%, i would put.
Speaker 1:Ryan Montgomery.
Speaker 2:there too, we can talk more about the rest of the list, but for sure heading up that hundred mile specialist list, yeah, so Arlen got third last year and I talked to him after the race at the award ceremony and, gosh, he was fresh as a daisy, he was just like you know, gosh, darn it. I Wish that I had packed more of my own nutrition, because I was drinking the rock tan, on course, and I don't think it was as strong as I normally mix it, and I just totally bonked the middle miles Like if I, if I went back again, you know, with the exact fitness I have, i think I think I knocked 30 minutes off the court, you know, off the race, and I think you know that would, that would be then winning. So Arlen left, yes, the last year feeling like he's got a lot, lot left to give.
Speaker 1:Brett, i have to say this AJW says there's a lot of returners coming back. Is that?
Speaker 2:me who said the returners are coming back. I'm like you know what, sometimes here at single track HQ, we got to point out the obvious and like, yeah, the returners are coming back. Okay, one one quick thanks for calling us on our show.
Speaker 1:All right, quick story about Arlen Glick. So I was listening to the adventure jogger podcast, ryan Bluckerman. Dude has a beautiful voice that radio voice great podcast. Go check it out. But he had Arlen Glick on recently and one of the stories that Arlen told was about at Umstead earlier this year when he won the race 21 seconds spent at aid stations across. Whatever it was a 12, 13, 14 mile, 14 hour victory at Umstead like 21 seconds.
Speaker 2:So I was thinking about that and like Is that mean he's like not even stopping to like OP?
Speaker 1:He's on the run. He's on the run urinating. Yeah, or Diapers We've been saying that all week Arlen winner is getting.
Speaker 2:that depends sponsorship Yeah but like yeah, i mean I think we are getting to the point where People are gonna be gambling At Western states with their aid station stoppage time. You know, before it was kind of like take your time at the aid station, cool off. Like, really, take your time to get your ice drinks and fluids cool off. How much of that can you cut out of your race without blowing it in between the aid stations?
Speaker 1:Yeah, do to overheating.
Speaker 2:Yeah, this is. This is definitely a year where you could cut a little bit of that out of your race.
Speaker 1:I Don't think it's a one-for-one comparison But I think in some ways Arlen Glick is our generations Carl Meltzer. You know. In years past and podcasts past you would hear Carl Meltzer say that he was never The fastest guy in the field, never the most talented guy in the field, but he was super efficient at aid stations. And I just hearing Arlen Talk about how much emphasis he was putting at reducing stoppage time to stay competitive, to stay in it, i think is interesting. I do think as the years go on, as our sport matures, better athletes come through.
Speaker 2:That's gonna be more and more negligible a way for him to stay relevant, but super impressive and I mean, not only Did Arlen only have like 21 seconds of stoppage time, he absolutely demolished that race demolished. So like Arlen clearly is fit, arlen's been running great. Arlen got third at Western States last year like Running trails for like four weeks. Yeah, he didn't even like he wasn't even going to do much for trail running. And then he came down before the Memorial Day runs and went on some runs with Cole and was like, oh, i Need to do some hills. And then just like blasted a few and like already got third. So Will that translate well to a Cooler year where you do have to be Speedier, like is Arlen ready to knock 90 minutes off of what he ran last year?
Speaker 1:I'm not ready to say 90. I do think Arlen. I do think Arlen runs faster than he did last year. The other thing I heard on the adventure jogger episode with him is just how much more dialed in this year He'll be with his nutrition. You know not to plug one of our sponsors, but I believe for almost the entirety of Western States He's he's gonna be 90% Morton 320 drink mix and about 10% Coca-Cola. Shouts to our sponsors shoutouts Morton is what it is. Look at that. Look how shameless bread is drink mix 320 ah.
Speaker 2:Hydro gel By car, by car, solid 225, buzzword gel, calf, future nutrition. Actually, stay tuned. Later on this week We are gonna record an episode with a Josh row from Morton Yeah that's. That's gonna be really interesting. If you want to learn you know anything about the science behind Morton and their products, Ask you know. Send those questions to us, because Josh will have the answers.
Speaker 1:So, brett, two more returners that are returning as you like to say.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yes, alex Alex.
Speaker 1:Nichols and, in my opinion, his protege Cody Lind, m8 and M9 both Scott Scott athletes, both Scott athletes, both kind of Talented yet non-descript type athletes in this race. Like they're not gonna be bringing, like these like big, you know bold, they're not gonna talk about themselves that much but they're just gonna show up and and throw down and and take spots in the top ten.
Speaker 2:Yeah, i agree I. I Would have Alex Nichols higher in my placing if the conditions were tougher. Alex Nichols got second in 2017 And that year was incredibly snowy and very hot and that that would play into Alex's hands more The snow up top, like I feel confident He's going to get through the first 50k better than most. I agree He. He ran up and down pikes like last week. I agree again, but Then will he have the, the running speed for the next 70 to then carry on like, like what we had said, that Tom has like 15 hour pace, 14, 30 pace, like that's a little bit out of Alex's lane, yep, so that will be interesting to see. You know another in, you know another Like all reliable. I mean, i'm sad that we're not going to see Drew Holman this year, but we do get to see Tyler Green who he's done such good battle with in the past. Yeah, so Tyler was fourth last year Coming back. I was, you know, creeping a little bit on a Strava and his training this year looks much better than last year. It it just looks a little bit more complete. All the weeks are a little bigger. They don't necessarily look risky, just smart. There's down weeks in there. The training block was a little bit longer. We got to run with him on Monday. He seemed like he was in great spirits.
Speaker 1:I Think Tyler's ready to roll huge Tyler Green fan. You know Tyler has Again don't quote me I believe he's had a second place here. He's had something like a ninth place here and then a 14th place here over the last five to six years. At that point You've done so much at this race. You've been reliable, you've been dependable. What's left to do? win the race? like, you have to wonder. like, is he putting an extra work to take risks out there?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, race day. Throw some.
Speaker 1:Throw some biscuits at the wall and see what sticks as Liam says, and you know, we had a chance to shake out with Tyler yesterday and he was talking a bit about that third place finish at Trans Grant, canary earlier this year and, just with more context, i appreciated just how impressive that podium was. The two guys that finished ahead of him top 10, that UTMB and CCC respectively last year, and I think it just shows where Tyler's racing is at, where his fitness is at, and You know, i think he's probably at the back end of his peak run or just based on age, but he looks great And I think he has the right attitude, so It's hard to pick against him. I think he's one of those guys where it's like you see Anthony in the field, you see Tom in the field, you see Hayden in the field, but then it's like Tyler Green. Like Tyler Green is still there, he's still incredibly relevant, he's still incredibly talented and he's got more to give. So he could be like and he's like the, the ultra running equivalent of like a Bracket Buster, like you have these like guys that are like you know, on paper They look sexy, look amazing, but like Tyler's there to like clean up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's like, will he really get past the third round? like Like we, like we know he's going to get to like the quarter finals, but like that's right. Will he make it to the semis or the final?
Speaker 1:Sorry, brett, just had to make a request for a LaCroix my throat is parched.
Speaker 2:Other name that I'm really excited. This and yeah, we've got two more returners that we want to highlight Ludovic Pomeray, former UTMB champ m6 from last year. Give zero F's about how the race is going to play out like he led through truly runs his own race, but in the most Just ballistic way he led through for Robinson flat last year And it was awesome and I thought he was going to completely explode. Only minor, minor fade to say you know, minor fade. Do we see Ludo leading through Forest Hill again this year? because he's just simply better at running mountains than most of the people in this field. I Mean.
Speaker 1:I think that the current high country conditions are made for someone like Ludo Pomeray who, you know, part of his Calling car is success at some of the most technical, demanding Mount Elf trail races on the International Circuit. So, and yeah, i mean, he's an ageless wonder He's, you know, he's in that same category of like you know, in ultra running, jeff Browning, and basketball, you know this haslam and baseball, jamie Moyer, and football, adam Vinitieri like when is this guy gonna go out? It's not readily apparent that he's anywhere near finished and, damn, i'm excited to see him race on Saturday. Yeah, this guy, ludo, is a wild card.
Speaker 2:Like. I love that He's a wild card. Usually we don't get wild cards coming from the returning top 10, but I would. I put Ludo in the wild card category. One more name Scott Trier. Scott Trier For one. If you haven't, if you don't, if you're not following him on Instagram, please do. He just released the greatest like vote for me, real, to put him in, and he he called himself kind of the old reliable of like I'm, i'm going to be in the top 10. Yep, which, yeah, that was kind of something we were we were debating Offline is like are there people, are there still people in this field who are racing For top 10, or is everyone trying to podium? I think it's clear that there are definitely still a good amount of people who You know. If they get in the top 10, like, that's a win, that's a great day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and again I would. I would love to be proven wrong. I I don't think Scott Trier is here to win the race. I know that that sounds ridiculous to say, but I have a feeling that he would just love to keep the train rolling of, like mixing it up in the Mid to back half of the top 10 and kind of having those like I told you so type performances where it's like you bet against him And he like finished eighth and ran, you know like 15, 12, kind of like the year. You know Browning ran whatever it was like 1545 and you know was right there with like Steven Kersh and Cody Reed at the end of the day, like that, you know he could be their dad.
Speaker 2:He could be their dad and he's running 1545. Who's your daddy? And everyone said, you know like, oh, the only reason browning gets in the top 10 because They're hot years and he doesn't have to run under 60 hours. Like you can do it on difficult conditions and only be 70 hours.
Speaker 1:It's like well look at that, i feel like Scott, even though the age Differences are vast. Scott could be like the Scott fable in this race where it's like you know, scott is gonna be there finishing ninth at the Boston Marathon. He's gonna like hit his potential right there and nothing more. And I think we're gonna see someone like Scott Schraer just like Right there in that like seven to ten spot And it's gonna happen very close to the end of the race, like he'll be in, you know, 11 or 12, that pointed rocks and cleans up in those last five or six miles.
Speaker 2:So yeah, like you don't. You don't want Scott to be right behind you in the last 10 miles. No, you don't want to be that person. So that that covers our returners. Let's move on to some international golden tickets. So this is anyone who got a golden ticket in one of the international golden ticker races.
Speaker 1:I think we should leave with golden tickets. Okay, yeah, let's do golden tickets first. Yeah, so I had it myself.
Speaker 2:I kind of confused myself looking at this because, tom Evans, his golden ticket was a third at UTMB, that's right, even though he got second at Black Canyon, that's right. His golden ticket was third at UTMB and That, yeah, we'll get into the domestic golden tickets because, in like, the black Canyon golden ticket rolled down So we got an extra there. Tom Evans Great inter pre-race interview with him, one of the more professional runners this sport, also not afraid to just kind of tell it How it is of like yep. I've been training hard, physically, mentally, like checking all the boxes, also not afraid to say like, yeah, people are gonna be running 14 hour pace at the end, like that's just what it's going to take to win. I love hearing that.
Speaker 1:Tom Evans in Jeff Colt, i think, of the interviews we've done. I left those interviews thinking, like those two athletes know themselves so deeply, like they've left no Stone unturned in the corners of their mind and they will have a strategy at every single point where they get like Kick to the curb for like okay, this is exactly how I'm gonna get out of this, this is the self-talk that's gonna work. Like I press this self-talk button and it's gonna get me five miles down the course at like the pace I need to be going and you know the calories I need to be eating. Like they are so mechanical about How to be successful in every single area, including the intangible stuff.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, yeah, tom Evans, tom, i mean. And yeah, that 30 UTMB last year was nuts like that was very impressive. That was a great race. Daniel Jones, winner of the Tarware 100k over Hayden Hawks, that's a I mean, that's a pretty legit golden ticket. They were racing, you know, maybe even too legit, too legit to legit to quit. Uh, training partners. Dan Jones has been here for a while. We've seen him up here all week. He was hanging out a broken arrow. I think he got to talk to him and we're a little bit enamored with just how cool he was. Looks like he could be Dakota Jones's brother which is crazy, like Dakota. Dakota and Daniel Jones like duh. Of course they're related. I'm I'm putting him in my wildcard category because he beat M2. They're training together. Yep, it's so facto. He might be better. And I mean, how do you, how do you, poke a hole through that argument?
Speaker 1:Dan Jones has been Deploying the modern-day successful Western State strategy, which is get in the Grand Canyon in mid to late May and get in there often. You know, do do an right angel loop. What do we got in the chat? What are you seeing?
Speaker 2:Oh, it's just uh, talking about times, and I mean the depth is deep.
Speaker 1:the depth is deep, you know, is 1512 for eighth place ridiculous?
Speaker 2:It probably is but this is gonna be a cool year. Ridiculous, it is ridiculous. It's definitely my pins again.
Speaker 1:I don't do public math. I don't always do public finishing times, you know, maybe it is more in the back half of the 15s, but it's a cool year. Another name here That I want to highlight is Matthew Blanchard. We were talking with Jeff. Massive, massive name, absolutely massive name beat Tom Evans at UTMB. It's pretty versatile. You know he's done like the coastal challenge. He just recently ran a 221 marathon which you know It's like minimum viable. You know marathon pedigree to be in this like and he's like a tv star.
Speaker 2:He was on like survive or something like that He's wrote a book.
Speaker 1:But anyways, matthew Blanchard, if you, if you take Killian Out of the equation, matthew Blanchard had performance of the year last year.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean even when we put.
Speaker 1:Killian to the brink to the brink.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, i mean yeah, they went. He pushed Killian in the middle and late stages of the race Cradle with the finish line because like they both got not not that many people Have ever been able to push Killian like in anything like. Usually it's Killian who pushes Killian the most, but Matthew Blanchard, like, gave Killian a scare at UTMB. I'm so curious How that equates to success at western states. I'm just, i'm, i just, i don't know. I don't know where, where I'm, like where to put him. I mean, i did put him somewhere. I just have to scroll down a little bit because I've already forgotten. But Yeah, i'm so curious, what do you think? How do you think?
Speaker 1:I mean, i just feel like when you do what Matthew Blanchard did at UTMB, you get like the, the ultranning equivalent of your green jacket, like your confidence For the rest of your racing career is just like it's secure, like you can just take risks, you can do whatever the hell you want and you can just refer back to You know 2022 UTMB as like where you could be, you know, at any given moment.
Speaker 2:I'm just gonna set up a little bit more light, because the sun's starting to go down. Okay, brett's gonna get some light. I'll talk a little bit. I'll talk a little bit about a couple more of these guys while Brett fixes some of the light.
Speaker 1:One person that I really want to Talk about that doesn't come from the international golden ticket system is Gion Shang Shen. I apologize if I'm mispronouncing that name. There were there were a couple people in the chat that had highlighted his name earlier and, you know, said Hey, go look at this guy's Strava, because it has been, as Liam Aid, station Fireball would say, and a certifiably monstrous buildup. He's been in and around the western states course since the end of May. He did, i think, 90 miles on the course in three days that first week of June. Day one was Robinson Flat to the river. Day two was oh gosh, i gotta Remember my acronym is here but another 30 mile day. And then he did Greengate To the finish on day three. The next weekend he did back to back four hour runs On the way to cool course and then back on the western states course again more in full. A lot of weekends with these back to back eight to four, 14 hours time on feet. I think one other cool part about him is he's a part of that UTMB elite athlete support program where I think they you know that their calling card there is like they're sensitive to the needs of, you know, athletes that you know might need some financial backing to make this type of course specific training possible. I think UTMB did play a part in helping facilitate that training and so UTMB believes in judging Shen.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and one thing to note not only was he putting out these monstrous training runs on the western states course, many of them were around Wamsley's course record splits. Do you think there's a chance that we see An attempt to go off the front early? uh, all a true heart brown style in hopes that he kind of disappears and people forget about him. Is he the one To wire? if? if someone's going to try to wire, to wire this race, is uh Zheng shen Shen the one to do it?
Speaker 1:the sixth Tape to tape win in western states, men, field history Happening in 2023. I think he's going to be the first to go 2023.
Speaker 2:I think if anyone's going to do it, it's going to be him, because You know he is one of the lesser well known runners In this field. Unless you're a station fireball, then you're his number one fan He could. He could be the one to be leading to the escarpment and rip some miles up through red star and get lost in the trees And people will kind of forget about him fun fact 2022 utmb.
Speaker 1:My partner, jewels, and I were in the geneva airport Waiting for one of those buses to shamanie and I didn't know it at the time, but there was gian shen, shen draped in north face gear. Didn't know he was an ultra runner, but just saw the you know north face gear walked over and said are you by any chance running, utmb? And he said he did and we had a great conversation. Nice guy, um, really humble, just a heart. You know He, he talks with his hard work and, uh, we got. We got a. Jewels took a photo So we'll post that on instagram. Maybe he was, he was fourth at ccc last year, fourth at ccc Which. I thought he did utmb last year and in dnf'd. I could be wrong.
Speaker 2:No, that was. I think he dnf'd at trans grand canary just this year. Yeah that was his only blip in the training. That, uh, has me worried a little bit, but I predict Josh ang shen is the one to go off the front now, do I think that's good, that tactic is going to work no but I think, i think he's going to be the one to try. Sorry, we kind of jumped over into like our miscellaneous category filled it. Um, ryan gumry is another one of our international golden tickets. He's an american, but you got his golden ticket at the tarawa 100k, third place behind Hayden hawks, who would not take a golden ticket because he was already in the race and a great Story about ryan.
Speaker 1:He has now been registered for western states, i believe the last three years, golden ticket at Hovelline a hundred the year before this, but had to drop out of western states due to injury. I think he had a sponsor spot before that, um, so you know this. There's kind of like a redemption here, like he's finally getting to the start line, healthy, ready to go by all measures on strava and what we've heard from him firsthand, very excited to see what he can do. I I categorize him as being one of those people, kind of like scott treyer, where A great day for him would be to get into that back half of the top 10. He is, like arlin, one of those hundred mile specialists and this is a great race for him.
Speaker 2:Yeah, my, my biggest Concern with ryan montgomery is just that the durability factor, because you know ryan has dealt with it a good handful of injury issues and You have to have some pretty solid durability to to get through the first 50k, you know, relatively unscathed this year, but i'm really happy to see ryan on the start line. It's it's definitely been a long time coming.
Speaker 1:Matt feldic in the chat. Bret wants to know if we can disclose who's cougar It is that we have on set. Are we allowed to disclose that?
Speaker 2:I that we are going to keep that a secret and we might Let the owner of this cougar, uh, say who's it is someone in the chat saying it's cal herner.
Speaker 1:I don't know who that is.
Speaker 2:I mean there's no name on it. Like no name, I mean for all you know it could be mine, That's right. I mean shoot Why wouldn't we just assume it was minor fins? um, so then, uh, we also have the first and second place from the doi intonon 100 mile in thailand, which was A golden ticket race last, i believe it was november. Um, we have jaju jiao and kenhua luo. Um, fun fact about kenhua is, uh, he's sponsored by kylus, which is a brand that i'm sure, a lot of a lot of people haven't heard of. But they have as wide of a product range as solemn, from like mountaineering gear to very, very high quality technical Running gear. I actually wore a kylus pack last year at western states. Um, really cool Just to see a kylus athlete, you know, lining up at western states.
Speaker 1:Yeah, i saw the pack you were wearing, you know, just on our, our training ones, when we were uh Out in phoenix for bandera and black canning coverage and good stuff. Should we talk about, uh, domestic golden ticket winners here? Yeah, I'll kick us off, i'll kick us off, i mean maybe the. The person of the hour for us is jeff colt And again, if you haven't had a chance to go and listen to that Interview, jeff was just straight up, lucid and spit and fire about his intentions for western got us riled up.
Speaker 2:I loved the intensity and like like we were calling it, like like jeff colt 2.0.
Speaker 1:It was jeff, it's jeff, colt 2.0.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like he even said too, because I like, jokingly, was like What, what is this new jeff? and he was like, oh, like It is a new jeff and and it was really all for the better. I mean it's just was like You know, i mean, yeah, we won't, we won't tell the whole interview. You got to go listen to it, but it was, you know, like some big life changing moments made him realize like dude, what the hell am I doing? Like I have a shot at being really good at this, this running thing. Like why am I not seriously taking this shot? He's so cool that jeff's taking that shot.
Speaker 1:He's like the 1% of individuals that are still following their new year's resolution. It's like in, you know, on december 31st 2022. He's like i'm gonna be a better.
Speaker 2:I'm gonna do a little bit of experience and like you know, fast forward to june.
Speaker 1:You know, 21st, 20th, 2023, he's still on the plan. He looked good, he like sitting down here. I'm like damn, like dude's ready to rake vascular af.
Speaker 2:Good, I mean, uh, you've been drinking that. That beat juice.
Speaker 1:So we won't we won't ruin the interview, but go check it out if you want to see his intentions. We got a. We got to leave some mystery to it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we've got um, i guess we'll. So you know, jeff, jeff, one, bandera. We'll go to second at bandera. Um so that's jp giblon jp giblon.
Speaker 1:Yeah, run it for ultra have seen him around town this week.
Speaker 2:Yeah, jp's. Um, i don't know racing seasons, since bandera is Interesting. He's raced four times when Yeah, four times he had. He actually started the black canyon 100k After getting a golden ticket at the bandera 100k, ultimately dropped and then ran 250k's, both of which were all right. Um, i'm curious to see where he's at from, like you know, a headspace and like fitness standpoint, just because, like, of the four races He's done the best one was the, the first one.
Speaker 1:Talked to, had a chance to talk with him at the broken arrow 46k this past weekend in person. We were just kind of sitting there at the finish line waiting for some of his friends to come through. I was waiting to do some interviews and He he's a self-proclaimed 100 mile specialist as well. He had been telling me that, you know, similar to ryan mongomery, similar to arling gulk, he puts himself in that category and He feels that, you know, the best of himself is not displayed until he's at this 100 mile distance. And I think a lot of those races you mentioned you know, 50k, 100k range, not his strong suit, but also, you know, you wonder like Maybe he could have put together More prototypical western states build-up type thing. But I also wonder like, did he expect to get that golden ticket at bandera so early in the season? Was he expecting to kind of follow like an emily hogwood style path where you know, maybe he had to fight for it after bandera at black canyon, at canyons like?
Speaker 2:I don't know.
Speaker 1:Maybe he was just kind of like he was fulfilling the rest of what he'd already registered for it.
Speaker 2:Maybe he was, like, you know, crushed bandera. so well Is then like, oh Shoot, maybe I should just keep rolling and like, try black canyon. like, maybe I'll get fitter, you know, perhaps, like eyes were a little bit bigger than his stomach, um, and it's like, well, i'm already signed up, i might as well just do it, you know. so I hope he's recovered and like, ready to roll.
Speaker 1:He's another bracket buster for me. I think he fits into that. You know, scott trayer, tyler green, um, we'll talk about him in a second john ray tight mold where it's like, is he?
Speaker 2:gonna be like the new kid on the block for the top 10 lock after this year. The problem is you have to get in the top 10 this year. Yeah which, like that's not going to be easy. Yep, yeah, we're. we're dealing with some uh, we're fixing some lighting The lighting is ever changing as the sun sets in palisades, tahoe. But uh, fortunately we have Techno geniuses, uh, ethan and Dylan here to uh help keep us afloat. Seems good. Thanks, dude. Yeah, this is great. Wow, um, yeah, thanks to you know as his coach.
Speaker 1:I think you got to talk about colwatson next.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, before I do that, I want to say Yeah, um, before I do, thanking Ethan and Dylan, this might be a nice time to thank our sponsors.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, um yeah, You know, I guess this is a mid mid roll Adry this is a mid roll adry, but we I think we have, you know we got 76 people watching. That we can influence. I think the first one we could shout out is rabbit, because you were in the rabbit flannel Yeah, i love the rabbit flannel.
Speaker 2:I mean it's funny, like fin had to put a puffy on. I'm doing just fine in my rabbit flannel, so it's a nice great temperature regulating shirt. Um, um, if you want to try out some great rabbit apparel, uh, Well, yeah, if you want to try some rabbit apparel, maybe head to our third and final group run tomorrow morning at 9 o'clock. We're going to hit the trail from the, the granite chief trailhead here in palaces. Oh, we do have some. We do have a few pieces of rabbit apparel. One thing that we do have is we have the elusive Rabbit ice bandana. Yes even though it's going to be a cooler year, it's not a no ice year. If you need, if, even if you're, if you're athlete or you're running, you don't want to come to the run, show up. Um, you know we're gonna start running at 9. Show up around 10. Come grab a ice bandana. Come say hey, we'll get you an ice bandana.
Speaker 1:And also if you're remote and you can't make it in your interest and try not this gear. Use code single track 20 at check out on the rabbit website For 20% off your next order. We also have a rab features, the sock company, these foot forms here.
Speaker 2:Yep, they're sponsoring us. This is my favorite sock company of all time. I've Raced all of my hundred miles in that. Features Features elite mini crew.
Speaker 1:We'll be handing those out in spades at the group run again. If you can't be there. Their website featurescom F e e t u r e s. Use code single track 20 there for 20% off your next order. Morton, we talked about them earlier, so I don't feel compelled to do an ad. Read here, hoka. How about hoka? Talk about their shoes, yeah.
Speaker 2:Oh dude how are these for some hokas?
Speaker 1:Bam, but bam that and your pipe and smoke it.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, This is a limited edition cheetah print Bondies. Huge thanks to Hoka Hickson for helping me lock down a pair of these. They've been sitting in my closet for like almost.
Speaker 1:Two years I had no idea why I owned this shoe.
Speaker 2:But then, once broken era western states week was coming to fruition, i knew exactly why I had this shoe. So Go check out some hokas, we're gonna see. you know, last year hoka was the most worn shoe at western states. The shoe that you know definitely is being promoted the most around western states is the new hoka tecton x2. That is their carbon plated trail racer. Yep, um, definitely designed around, you know, the Western States. course, it's actually a much more versatile shoe than that. If you wanna see a more in-depth look at the HokaTekton X2, finn and I actually did a full review of that on the conversational pace shoot channel, and conversational pace is a trail shoe review channel and it's dedicated towards in-depth trail shoe reviews where Finn and I we run a minimum of a hundred miles on each shoe before we actually talk about it because we wanna give a little bit more legit peak into how the shoe is gonna perform over the course of the entire life of it.
Speaker 1:So there you have it. Morton Rabbit features in Hoka, grateful for their support, i think. Just so people know where we're going with the rest of the episode, we're gonna finish talking about some of these runners that you know punch their way into states via domestic golden ticket races, and then I think where I wanna go after that. Brett is just categorizing people who can win, people who can podium and people who can top 10, and then we'll do our picks.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah, I guess, like the people who can win, podium and top 10 are my picks, one through 10. And I'm sure ours won't be identical that'd be insane. So, yeah, let's do the-.
Speaker 1:Let's do the black canyon, yeah, talk coal, yeah, okay.
Speaker 2:So coal Watson ran the black canyon 100K, got fourth. Actually I only missed a golden ticket by one spot. Had a good day there. Those who know coal know that the fitness is always there. It's always come down to some of the other things like nutrition, the actual race execution, the pacing, the strategy. You know coal's been one to always never feel like he's working enough And pretty much every golden ticket race that he had done he would like crank the dial to 12 too early. And then you know coal would beat himself Yep After black canyon. That happened to black canyon, you know he took the lead and cranked the dial just a little bit too much and then ended up with some stomach problems around mile 40. But bounced back, you know, didn't do too much, nothing crazy, between black canyon and canyons and hopped on the start line of canyons and just the whole focus was to execute all the little parts of the race And don't do like you don't need to swing for the fences, like you just do. You went all the spots that you're supposed to do them. That led to an enormous victory. I'm so excited that Cole is back on the Western States start line. He ran Western States last year. I think he got 14th. He was in the top 10 all day until stomach problems got the best of him at the river And in somewhat of a unique situation it was because he was overeating. Cole was eating upwards of 600 calories an hour every single hour until the river And then he ultimately like blue chunks all over the place. So we've been working on the nutrition side of things. We've also been working on just like staying present in all the parts of the race.
Speaker 1:And he has the engine and the athleticism to win this race on a good day, Yeah yeah, cole.
Speaker 2:I put Cole into that speedster category where it's like Cole is a very talented run. He ran like 151 for the 800 in high school. He ran at the University of Oregon. He's qualified for the Olympic trials in the marathon. He's run some very fast shorter races. He's one of the few people who's like he beat Max King in a road 10 mile one time. Yeah, yeah, it just doesn't happen too often, but so I'm just really excited for Cole to be back at Western States.
Speaker 1:He's the local boy, yeah the people that took golden tickets on the domestic front this year. it's a stout list. You know Anthony Costales and Janusz Kowalczyk at Black Canyon, dakota Jones and John Ray at Javalina, jeff Cole and we just talked about JP Gilman as well at Bandera, adam Mary and Cole, your guy at Canyon, the pedigree from these guys that we just mentioned, they're all people that are going to be contenders in this top 10. So it's not just like they punched their way in and they're, like you know, hoping to get top 30 or top 20. These are heavy hitters. The 2023.
Speaker 2:Golden ticket class is pretty good. It's great, i guess. I would love to see a graph of, like the golden ticket winners The classes I want to see the classes and like what are some six Like who are some of the best golden ticket classes to perform there, western States. And like I feel like this is a good one. I mean it's crazy that you know we have like just an absolute legend and veteran of Dakota Jones racing Western States for the first time in 13 years And just, and that was just dominating, Yeah, Like I mean, I'm just going to say like he was toying with his competitors, toying one of which had just gotten third at Western States that year. Yep, Yeah, I'm really excited to see it Decoded, as we had him in the studio yesterday.
Speaker 1:We had a great spot, another great spot mentally. He's a great spot mentally.
Speaker 2:Great previous interview. Yeah, The only one. The only thing that worries me a little bit was the 650 mile bike ride to get to the race. And is he biking home?
Speaker 1:Yeah, That was the biggest question in the comments that I cannot believe we didn't think of that was.
Speaker 2:Is he riding home? I don't know. Let's talk about John Ray for a sec.
Speaker 1:Yeah, john Ray is definitely throwing training eggs against the wall and hoping they don't crack, and this is my opinion. By the way, i love John Ray. We've had him on the podcast multiple times. Humble guy, hard worker.
Speaker 2:We will have him on Tuesdays and Thursdays. He's coming on the pod on Thursday.
Speaker 1:We're doing a pre-race interview. but humble guy, environmentalist, cares about the community, nicest person we'll ever meet, but he's training with an absolute fury. Did a 50 mile, almost 50 mile training run maybe seven to 10 days ago, two weeks before the race. Yeah, it was like 40 something miles and then backed up with like a 20 mile or the next day And he's coached, so you have to assume that at the very least the time on feet he did was in the ballpark of being prescribed.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, like everything I mean, you assume that if you have a coach that everything's being done, then for a reason. So I can't wait to hopefully get into the nuts and bolts of that a little bit Cannot wait.
Speaker 1:Which John.
Speaker 2:Ray, like you know, maybe there's a stimulus, you know, benefit of training, for maybe, say, like 150 mile race, then you get to drop down to a hundred. I don't know, i'm speculating, we will find out. This is a fantastic golden ticket, cohort.
Speaker 1:Amazing. Yeah, maybe we'll do some research after this to analyze the across the years. But, brett, i made three lists and I'd love to run them by you to see if I've missed anybody. The first one is I made a list of seven people. I think there's seven people in this field who can win the race Anthony Costalis, dakota Jones, hayden Hawks, tom Evans, matthew Blanchard, dan Jones and Cole Watson. Did I miss anyone there Who can win Not podium, but win? John Chang, yeah, john Chang, okay.
Speaker 2:I put him in my podium list. But, yeah, i think, yeah, i think that's the group that, like, could win the race. I don't, did you say Dan Jones? I put Dan Jones in there. Yeah, i don't know, gosh, i mean, adam Peterman did win the race last year in his first 100 mile, first Western states. Like it can be done, i'm just I'm not. I think if Dan Jones wins the race, it's a massive upset. But one thing that's interesting I don't know if you did this on purpose or not Every single person that you listed is like a pretty elite, fast runner.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:The slowest is probably Matthew Blanchard.
Speaker 1:The slowest is probably Matthew Blanchard.
Speaker 2:Yeah, who's like a 221 marathoner, and I think the fastest is Anthony Castals with a 212.
Speaker 1:PR. Yeah, I don't think that hard work paired with above average talent is going to be sufficient to win this race. I think that you have to have. I think genetics have to be on your side. Just undergrace.
Speaker 2:And I think that glaring omission that is now starting to pop up in the chat is where is? where is Arlen? Arlen? is Arlen?
Speaker 1:I have Arlen as podium potential. I think you could finish as high as second in this race. I don't see him winning this race.
Speaker 2:I have to agree with you and I wouldn't have. I would say Arlen could win this race if it was going to be 100 degrees out.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I think Arlen needs the added difficulty of the weather. If you take out the weather variable and you make it more of a foot race I don't know if Arlen is there yet And a lot of people are going to say have you not seen what Arlen has run for some flat 100 miles.
Speaker 1:Of course have. We've not after it.
Speaker 2:This is not a flat 100 miler, this is different. This is a climbing. It's a hybrid race. What do we call it? We call it a hilly 100 mile.
Speaker 1:It's a hilly 100 mile.
Speaker 2:It's one of the only world class hilly 100 miles. And there's a lot of down hilly in it. It's different.
Speaker 1:So from that seven I have, i've listed seven people who can win this race. I'll add six more that I think can podium. So second and third place Arlen Glick, john Ray, jeff Colt, tyler Green, yannish Koalchik and John Shang-Chan. Those are my six that I would add that have podium potential. The podium potential, yeah, and the crazy thing is we've now listed like 12 people that could be podium potential 12 podium potential runners and then, to round out the people who I think in top 10, i've got eight here Alex Nichols, cody Lynn, scott Trier, ryan Montgomery, adam Mary, jp Givlin and Ludo Palmer. So sorry, seven, seven more.
Speaker 2:Yeah, i get. I mean one thing I kind of started doing when I was like writing down all these lists is like dude, there's so many people, there's so many people, yeah, yeah. Someone asked is this is Anthony Costales's first hundred? No, he got second at RunRabbit a number of years ago.
Speaker 1:Yeah, anthony Costales is not. this is not his first foray into 100 mile racing. He got second at, i believe, the 20, 21 RunRabbit RunHunderMiler. He only lost to Dave Stevens. So if you don't know who Dave Stevens is, absolute baller out of Nelson, british Columbia, versatile I mean. You know. Just finished six that the broken arrow 46 K this past weekend One UTMB port of IR where he beat Jeff Moguvera. So Anthony has already dabbled in tough 100 milers. I would argue RunRabbit's a tougher 100 miler than Western in some ways. Yeah, Anthony is not new to this distance.
Speaker 2:Shall we go into our top 10s?
Speaker 1:Yeah, can I give you mine.
Speaker 2:Should we go? do we go 10 to one or one to 10?
Speaker 1:I think I'm going to go 10 to one and I'll just rattle them off and you can pick. Yeah, like well, you can quickly do your like 10 to five, So in 10th I have Tyler Green.
Speaker 2:Wow.
Speaker 1:In ninth and I don't know how this is possible after listening to our interview with Jeff earlier today but Jeff Colton ninth, yonesh Kowal, chicken eighth, dakota Jones in seventh, cole Watson in sixth, hayden in fifth, matthew Blanchard in fourth, tom Evans in third, dan Jones in second and Anthony Costales in first. Who was your third place, tom Evans?
Speaker 2:Where was Hayden Hawks? Fifth, Okay, okay, i'm just I gotta unpack it. It's 10s, a lot of names.
Speaker 1:I'm going to tighten mine into the chat.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah, okay. You said that you had, like you were bragging up your picks and that they were like the most boring, predictable picks you've ever done. You have Dan Jones in second.
Speaker 1:That's right, and if we have New Zealand in the chat, they know I'm not crazy for saying that.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:Okay, proceed Interesting, okay, wow.
Speaker 2:Yeah, i would love to hear what the chat thinks about this top 10.
Speaker 1:Yeah, to repeat, my podium is Costales, dan Jones and Tom Evans. Fourth through sixth is Matthew Blanchard, hayden Hawks and Cole Watson. Seventh is Dakota Jones. Eight is Koalchik, nine is Jeff Colt. Ten is Tyler Green.
Speaker 2:I just I feel like Tyler Green's getting better than 10.
Speaker 1:It's funny I actually haven't scrolled down on my notes This field is so deep that, no matter what you do, you're going to offend somebody. Yeah, yeah Like you're going to offend somebody Like I left out Arlen, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, i didn't even know.
Speaker 1:I forgot about that, but you look at the list and you're like all of those 10 guys deserve to be in the top 10.
Speaker 2:So when I started, the way I got to my top 10 was I wrote down all the people I thought could be in the top 10 without counting And I wrote 15 names. I wrote 15 names that I was like they will for sure be in the top 10. That doesn't work, that doesn't matter. You can't squeeze 15 into 10. And I had to just slowly eliminate one by one and start reordering, and I did that earlier today and I've already forgotten who's in my two through 10. I know who I got at one, but I also left out John Chang Shen.
Speaker 1:So my two my, admittedly my two glaring omissions are John Chang Shen and Arlen Gluck. I own that. Those are two fantastic to reiterate the word fantastic fantastic athletes that in many scenarios in this race could podium, and I have left them out.
Speaker 2:Can we give a shout to Jamil Curry, the legend in the chat.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we got a shout out. Jamil, one of my two, one of the best YouTube channels of all time. One of my two baseline heroes in this sport Run, steep, get.
Speaker 2:High is some of the best content.
Speaker 1:Yeah, i think that this studio exists in part because of the content that we have watched from Jamil over the years.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so what I?
Speaker 1:like to do for.
Speaker 2:AeroVipe gave me the confidence to think that I could try and build out something like this And like, so far it's actually working. Yeah, so like that's cool, shout out, matt. Thanks to Matt.
Speaker 1:Even though.
Speaker 2:Matt Fowler just called me Skip.
Speaker 1:Bayless, i still love you, matt. I still love you, matt. And you know what, matt? you must have missed our whole segment on Scott Trier because we gave him like 10 minutes of love in this episode.
Speaker 2:You gave him all the love and then you're like but he's not in my top 10. So I actually still have 14 names written down. Maybe I'll do my bonus four afterwards.
Speaker 1:You got to cut it, you got to trim this list.
Speaker 2:Well, I just didn't want to forget who I left out, okay, gotcha 10th place, I have Dakota Jones And I think that's because it's going to be a push for the podium and just not quite have the gas to make it to Auburn in that podium spot. 9th, I have Arlen Glick.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:So one of your people that you forgot And I love.
Speaker 1:Arlen, yeah, i love.
Speaker 2:Arlen, i love Arlen, i just don't.
Speaker 1:He's coming on the pod tomorrow. We're going to talk, i'm going to own my picks tomorrow with him live in our pre-race episode.
Speaker 2:You're going to tell him. You're going to tell him you didn't put anything I mean it makes for great content. I don't think Arlen doesn't deserve that. He deserves to be praised, and asked great questions, absolutely blasphemous. We'll have to figure out our interview tomorrow. I think we have to pretend that this whole preview show didn't happen.
Speaker 1:We're live right now. Yeah, you can't go back and tell him, no, i can't go back.
Speaker 2:No, takesies, backsies, touch blue, make it true. You can't do that, lloyd. 9th place I've got Arlen Glick. 8th place I've got Joshang Shen. I think Joshang Shen is going to take off from the gun. I don't think he's going to take the wire to wire victory, but I do believe that he's going to build such a giant buffer that he's going to be able to explode. Still to 9th place, secure that returning spot and then come back next year with a vengeance. 8th place Joshang Shen. 7th place I have Tyler Green. I think Tyler is one of those people that also benefits from more difficult conditions. Sixth place again, probably another hot take I have Hayden Hawks. I think similar to what I said for Dakota and Joshang Shen. I think it's going to be a minor fade as a result of the pace being pushed in the middle of the race. Fifth, and this person moved way up after the interview. This is possible to me. This one moved way up after the interview.
Speaker 1:This is possible to me, and that's Jeff Colt.
Speaker 2:I have Jeff Colt starting the top five and that's going to be with a big push in the second half.
Speaker 1:I now think after our interview, given his strategy, his floor is fifth. I don't think that my ninth pick for him makes sense post-interview with him but I do think he could stay in the race at fifth.
Speaker 2:I've got Jeff at fifth, which is going to be a great improvement over last year, from 11th to fifth.
Speaker 1:He's not going to be happy with it. You think he's one of the best natural athletes in the field.
Speaker 2:I think Jeff Colt is a freak athlete and I think he downplays that. If you're getting 11th last year coming off COVID and running 40 miles a week and then now finally taking it seriously, i think you need more than one year to see those types of improvements, but I think Jeff is further away from his ceiling than most of the people in this top 10.
Speaker 1:It's like before Christ, after Christ. Before Jeff took it seriously, after Jeff took it seriously.
Speaker 2:Jeff Colt two points.
Speaker 1:Do I have?
Speaker 2:the two eras of Jeff Colt.
Speaker 1:Yeah, jc, jc. Oh, oh my gosh Jeff, colt, the second coming.
Speaker 2:What did Andy Jones-Wilkins say? Jacking it into the ocean? I think he was talking about golf or something. Yeah.
Speaker 1:So that's Jeff Colt.
Speaker 2:Fourth place Matthew Blanchard.
Speaker 1:The first greatest performance of 2022 if you don't include Killian. Thank you.
Speaker 2:No, you, you lost me there for a second. I see what you're saying He pushed killing to the absolute limit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like the, the most anybody's ever pushed killing in this.
Speaker 2:I have Matthew Blanchard in fourth. I think I Think it'll be like a He'll be. I don't think it'll be at the front, but I think he'll be near the front and it will just be a race Between. You know, these top five and I think he's, he's guys think he's gonna get fourth. Like that's all I got for that. Third place, repeating 2019's performance in a sub 15-hour time Yeah is going to be Tom Evans. Hot take, mild take, i don't know Tom Evans Starting the podium sub 15 hours Okay. Second place, continuing with the black Canyon hundred K trend Anthony Costales he's still undefeated against Tom Evans after Western States Yeah and it's not just one race of black Canyon. Anthony actually beat Tom in.
Speaker 1:What did you say was Poland was like one of the world championships in Poland.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, so like Anthony's actually beaten Tom twice, yep, so I think Anthony is going to beat Tom, get second place also under 15 hours, but it's not gonna win. I think Also from the black Canyon cohort, but it's going to be greatly improved from that race is trails and tarmac's own Col Watson, the hometown hero. I think he's going to charge in the lead, it's not. He will not take the lead of this race until after mile 90.
Speaker 1:Which would be an extra. Knowing what we know about the history of how this race is one extreme rarity. Yes not happen since Jeff Rose. I believe in 2010. Yeah, unbreakable year.
Speaker 2:Yeah, i think if, if win Cole wins this race and I, for the love of God, cole, do not watch this Like I'm gonna text him out actually right after this. Do do not watch any of this pre-race crap. He doesn't need to be getting distracted with that.
Speaker 1:He knows a bunch of crap.
Speaker 2:He knows every inch of the course. Like he can run it with his eyes closed. Yeah, he's ready to roll Cole Col Watson with with the dub ski couple, couple questions I have for you.
Speaker 1:Well, sorry, one observation and then one question. You have, you have three Internationals in your top 10. I believe I have five Internationals in my top 10.
Speaker 2:So I think that's interesting, like just to see the growth of this top 10 being occupied by Non-American yes, cool, and I think that's a testament to showing how the International Golden ticket system is working as intended and the goal was to create a more International, world-class field instead of just a national class field. Yep, i think it's going to work. Yeah, and then there is definitely some names that I left out. Like I guess probably one of our biggest differences is, like I have Daniel Jones at 12th and you have Daniel Jones at second.
Speaker 1:Yeah that's.
Speaker 2:That's an interesting one.
Speaker 1:Yep. Yeah, that's let me ask you this how many of your top 10, what percentage of your top 10 is going sub 15 on Saturday?
Speaker 2:30, 30, 30%, 3 out of 10 3 out of 10 public math.
Speaker 1:So you entire podium is going sub 15.
Speaker 2:I think the entire podium is going sub 13, sub 15. The entire podium is going to 10. Sorry, typically we're saving me, but we had to save you there. The entire podium is going under 15 hours. I don't think the winner will be under 14 30 though. Okay, so I think we will see three between 14 30 and 15 hours, which plays into me saying Cole doesn't You know, doesn't take the lead Until like after mile 90, because it's not going to be a blowout, it's going to be close. Okay, what do you do? you think I'm gonna make a bold. I'm gonna make a bold prediction here. Next year We'll have a button that I can do for, like make noise, my course.
Speaker 1:Oh, I know course record watch.
Speaker 2:Do you think we're on course record watch this year? Is that what? what is the course? 1408, 1409?
Speaker 1:Well, so before I answer that question, let me ask you this Did you think at black canning this year that we would see that many people run sub eight hours and to go that far under eight hours? No?
Speaker 2:I didn't think it was gonna be that fast.
Speaker 1:I think that we're in for the same thing here. I think that I think, no matter what happens, we're gonna be shocked by the times. My bold prediction for this race is that we see the top six in the men's top 10 go sub 15. I'm not saying that all of them go 1430, but I think we're gonna see a lot of 1455s. We're gonna see a lot of 1445s, i think. I think more than half the top 10 is going sub 15. So, especially if we're following Tom Evans's prediction, where the first third of the course is gonna be on a 15 hour pace, the mid part, the mid third at 1430 and that last third at 1430. So, that he's. He's putting the crux at 1430.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. So okay, here's an interesting thought. We're gonna have to Do a little researching on this one later. Under 15 hours is just a little bit under halfway through the entire duration of the race. You know Western states is a 30 hour cutoff. Where how does that lie percentage wise, to like other races relative to their cutoffs? Like, are the winners just under that 50% mark? like what's UTMB 48 hours? I think it's a 40 hour cutoff, i think I always thought it was 48, but like it could be 48. If it was 48, then like 24 hours would be that 50% mark And they're like and typically you're seeing about 50 runners go sub 24 Yeah yeah, i don't. I don't know where I'm going with this, because I like the cutoff, so that's less than cutoff are totally up to the rest of our percent.
Speaker 1:Less than 2.5 percent.
Speaker 2:Hmm, i don't know where I'm going with that, but I just thought that was interesting that we're like looking at about half the total time that the course is open.
Speaker 1:I just think that, if we look, when we look back at 2023, even accounting for the abnormal weather, we're gonna look at this, this being the year we're at least on the men's side. Sub-15 was normalized.
Speaker 2:So the 15 is a normal time. That's our men's Prediction episode. That's it. We did it. We predicted the men's race. Yep, i'm, i am predicting things.
Speaker 1:Now I will say I am not gonna submit my fantasy free trail picks until Friday, probably at 11 59 pm Or whenever they lock it. like I'm texting Travis and I'm like Travis, travis Lunker When you lock in this thing, because I'm waiting till like the last second, i'm tempted.
Speaker 2:I'm tempted to just submit mine now, just so I don't forget, because, yeah, i can't, i can't do that. We got, we got to figure out what's on the line for Western states and we'll figure it out. I mean, i know it's at least a case of liquid death, but yeah you owe me like three liquid deaths. I know I owe you so much. I'm gonna get such a fat Amazon package.
Speaker 1:But anyways, yeah, that was our Western states preview episode. Hopefully you hopefully you had fun. I know we did and we're grateful for all y'all tuning in. One final shout out to Everybody that we have been working with in studio. Just a couple names Dylan Tanner, ethan. Mike McMonagall, our frequent co-host we miss her. Leah Yingling Hi Leah, the list goes on Jimmy Elam and a Fisher, like it's such. This is such a fun scene that we're in right now, like I Don't know.
Speaker 2:I thank you, bader, the incubator. Every morning at like 6 30, when I get up and we make our coffee and I've never been the first one downstairs, i'm usually get down here There's like three people on their computers Just like editing, cranking out content. It's so cool, it's just like, don't you incubator?
Speaker 1:just just so you know how packed this house is. I'm probably sleeping on this couch tonight. That's how packed it is. Like we're we're loving it.
Speaker 2:Okay. Well, it's just called his bed, it's sleeping.
Speaker 1:I'm sleeping outside on the deck.
Speaker 2:It's too. It's too sad. You guys can share one pillow in the middle. I'm like we can, we can get closer to I. Figured. I figured head-to-head. How do you share one pillow if your heads are both going that way? Yeah, you guys got to meet in the crack so Right on, hey?
Speaker 1:no, I think I guess we'll sign off here. But Brett, that was fun.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, so great If you're in town. We're gonna run from the Grand Chief Trailhead tomorrow morning at 9. Yep.
Speaker 1:We'll park in the village events enter parking lot. There's just more parking there.
Speaker 2:It's like a tenth of a mile down the road, So yeah but thanks everyone for all your hot takes and keeping us honest here and Yeah shouts to everyone in the chat. We this wouldn't be anywhere near as entertaining, you know, without all you guys and We will see you back again tomorrow. Peace.
